I can see how you felt that way. But...

Free speech and open source development
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I can see how you felt that way. But...

Postby clrcoda » Sun Aug 21, 2016 2:05 am

I was commenting on how the situation devolved, and how it seemed to get worse and that the public forum was no place for such activity handled in the poor way it was.

From the single post I ever had any opinion on the situation:

Dear Curt Olsen,
Well done, sir!
It was brave and generous of those that let it go on as long as it possibly could have. Every opportunity was granted to the ban-ees so long as their speech remain reasonable and a ban was only obvious.

This is very hard for me to say publicly because of a few reasons; none of which takes anything away from the praise above, but that I've grown to know and like these guys and what I will say here will be most assuredly a treason to them, a very unfortunate thing for me in the end.

Not that I liked some of the things I have read in this forum from them, but that I like them themselves as I got to know them despite what they wrote and the language they used in the forum.

I am angry with them because of it. I believe they would not now be banned had they not continued saying certain things and in certain ways.

Any technical problem -- surmountable. This was all

I don't know what this was.
Ray :(
Ray St. Marie

SO, Yes, I now agree, recall, and accept the fact that I had +1'd the action of the other forum's right to maintain the kind of decorum they wish. But I do hope you see how important it was for me to couch that opinion in my actual opinion of the people involved.

I hope this ends the punishment I receive because of it. If not, I don't think I could be faulted for it continuing.

Great flight today, the USA tour. In a plane I knew I couldn't fly. My best to you all.


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Re: I can see how you felt that way. But...

Postby IAHM-COL » Sun Aug 21, 2016 4:43 pm

Hi Ray

I am guessing my point was misunderstood,

I was not trying to punish you for writing what you quote above, at all.

Initially, it was my impression you said that I was trying to do something that would provide a sort of a disadvantage to users of Curtis' Forum. I mentioned to you that I was confused on what such thing meant. I have never, purposefully, intended to limit any-ones ability/ and freedom to access any forum board of their interest. Nor to judge anyone on that matter.

Firstly, I utterly disagree with the treatment users had received, and continue to receive on Curtis' Forum over a variety of topics, but more importantly, the acrimony and vengenceful attitude they display over anything related to FGMEMBERS (including terraGIT). Other users, such as SHM have been fully banned, and in general a mind-game is played on that game to inspire fear on people to mention FGMEMBERS, wherease a "take-a-side" attitude, a "you are with us or against us" attitude is actively propagated on that forum. And I repeat: I do not attempt to manipulate people that way.

I defended myself, therefore when you make such statement, in which I understood you suggested I attempt at punishing people still using the other forum. In my opinion, the reality is completely opposite to that. The reality is, IMO, that the other forum tries to punish people when they try to inform newer user of the available alternatives: be it - FGMEMBERS or terraGIT.

I found that situation bitter: it is encouraging an attitude of selfishness (with information and knowledge), and an indiscriminate attempt to keep users uninformed, and prevent them to have access to resources by obscurity. Do not let them know, per example that alternative scenery repositories with improved or different content exist, and propagate the voice that any content not belonging to "their source" is inconvenient, enemy, or even --alledgely--- illegal. To cite an example, WT411 recently posted an screenshot showing RJBB airport, and subsequently indicated that content was available on TerraGIT. Informing users of these alternatives is immediately seen as conflicting, and his posts are removed and he receives warnings and a really unjustifiable prosecution.

And therefore, when you even imply that I am (or we are) engineering ways to harm users on this or that forum, and as in the post of yours quoted above, per example, justify in some or another way Curtis behavior, I found myself at a lost to understand why do you think the treatment I have received is justifiable. And how, on top of that, somehow, you still see me as the wrongdoer.

And that is why, maybe a little too bluntly, I requested you on the tour, (and I quote myself Literally,

IAHMCOL on mumble wrote:Ray, Please do not go there.

If I requested to avoid that avenue of conversation in a very blunt way, I apologize to you. Simply I found it to be a rough edge, and a conversation I would appreciate you and I having: but not on the expense of risking that the tour becomes a "politicized" fight. All my interest remained in keeping the tour an amiable space. If you feel like you want to openly converse about this other topics, I am open to, and I would be actually happy to clarify any difference there. We could meet in mumble in a "non-tour" time. That was all I tried to convey.

Finally, I take you as my friend and flying pal, and your accompanying and participation on the tour, I see with the greatest pleasure, and I have always say so. I look forward to share the FG skies with you for many more tours, and events.

If we gave everybody in the World free software today, but we failed to teach them about the four freedoms, five years from now, would they still have it? Probably not, because if they don’t recognise their freedoms, they’ll let their freedoms fall

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